Wrestling with God and Men: Homosexuality in the Jewish Tradition,   ISBN:9780299190941

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I thought that this author was an excellent writer with interesting discussions, but part of me doesn't really care if there's some way to work around the prohibition and stay with orthodoxy (maybe because I wouldn't want to be orthodox as long as women are devalued, in my opinion, in that tradition).

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Wrestling with God and Men provides an excellent, well researched, and ballanced study of the issues of homosexuality and traditional Biblical law. In traditional Jewish scholarly form, he gives more time and respect to dissenting oppinions. Ultimately, his argument comes down to a lament over the death of Halacha. Until the enlightenment in the 19th century, the Halacha was a process by which matters were brought to reason before the Law (Bible or Torah). Essentially, the Halacha was a set of rules for change management that allowed an ancient Torah to respond to a never ending succession of modern changes to our human understanding of G_d's world. Modern Orthodox Judaism declared this process closed in response to the enlightenment and, in essence, killed Halacha. As a result, all his study and analysis is pointless because there is no longer a process for reviewing this (or any other) question before the law. Homosexuality is one of many questions that we struggle with today. The Torah (Bible) can provide guidance to help us make sense of these questions, whether or not we agree with those insights. Rabbi Greenberg provides a well documented, ballanced, scholarly analysis of some important insights the Torah provides to help us come to terms with this issue without telling the reader what to conclude.

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I read the original paperback edition of 2004. The book contains some 260 regular text pages, plus 31 pages of footnotes (altogether 328 pages). The author, an openly homosexual orthodox rabbi, had appeared in the 1999 documentary Trembling Before G-D.

Speaking in the popular language of separation I am not an Orthodox Jew, but the "original" holy texts which often get interpreted homophobically most certainly are of relevance to me, as their (King James) Bible derivations are used within the RastafarI branch of religion for the downpression of the constructed minority of homosexuals. Theologically, the book is of interest for any branch of religion which knows certain common stories, such as the one of Sodom.

There are advantages and disadvantages of this book being written by an ordained religious official. However, the air of authority is irrelevant to me personally: As a RastafarI I do not know such officials. The advantage is that this book departs from similar ones (of any closely related religion) in that it is less argumentative in a general sense, but is open to reassessing theological concepts. The disadvantage is, that the reasoning of the book has to be restricted to the parameters of (orthodox) Jewish theology. Which of course is again an advantage for the Jewish orthodox reader, but not necessarily on all issues to the reader who seeks more universal answers. I was also looking for some specifics of elsewhere averred alterations/mistranslations of early Jewish texts (e.g. at the time of the Egyptian diaspora), but of course a rabbi can't go into such a notion and I am not complaining as I respect other people's concepts of belief/knowledge.

I am also a mystic and appreciated the few references to the Jewish light on mysticism. In addition, the Ham story is of involuntary importance to RastafarI, as it was used to justify slavery, and I am always all ears of how this story gets interpreted in different ways. I am thankful for the author's elaborations on the Sodom story, as many other non-homophobic interpreters remain rather superficial when it comes to the anti-greed part. (Another advantage of the book having been written by a theologian instead of a scientist- or activist-only.) It was refreshing to read the "anecdote" suggesting that God has given the Torah to the humans and now it is their business to interpret it. In general books about the European Middle Ages, it gets usually forgotten how non-Christian homosexuals were treated. So it was interesting to learn that Jews weren't delivered to Christian courts and their corresponding (capital) punishments.

The theological differentiation between willful transgressors (not for pleasure, but rebellion) and indulgent transgressors (who can't resist temptation) is more for the specifically Jewish reader.

Not all of the author's reasoning I have to agree with. To begin with, it's a persistent myth that women can't get pregnant while nursing. As the opposite is the reality, intercourse by nursing women can't get used as another example of theologically allowed non-procreative sexuality. I agree (of course, what else?!) that holy texts (not only the Torah, but also e.g. the derived Bible) got freely reinterpreted to re-allow money lending with interest. In fact, banking was once termed another example of sodomy (unnatural reproduction of money) by the Church. I even do like the theology better which is against exploitation and classism as put forward in this book. However, I don't agree that it was such a good idea to radically change that prohibition or even to change it at all, taking a look a the local and global system, which is basically an extension of that downturned (overturned) ancient holy law. Ok, it DOES show a precedent for humans freely changing interpretations of holy texts. All I am saying is that it is a bad choice of example. Actually the worst, considering that it is about the original meaning of the Sodom story about greed and pitilessness.

I am flabbergasted to read from THIS author that the Jonathan-and-David-story would make most sense if Jonathan were homosexual, but David not: Though Jonathan "manages in battle, we find him not very aggressive or interested in military prowess. He doesn't think strategically." As a pacifist and draft dodger I would applaud, if being homosexual would automatically equal the same attitude. But isn't talk like that supposed to be foolish prejudice? In any case, in the ancient world, the opposite of that was at least one of the realities. In fact, some Greek city states especially employed and encouraged homosexual warrior couples. Hawaiian warriors bonded sexually before battle. (Make love, then war.) Fascinating concept, even if not my cup of tea, so I just ordered Gay Warriors: A Documentary History from the Ancient World to the Present.

All of that said, the upper line is: This is a great book. Challenging in different ways for both sides of the issue. For that what it is, this book succeeds. It clearly shows that where there's a will there's a way. This book has a heart. Which seems to be the diametrical opposite of the hatemongers - of any branch of religion. And I am not sure wether religion is supposed to be engaged in without a heart.

You may also be interested in Christianity, Social Tolerance, and Homosexuality: Gay People in Western Europe from the Beginning of the Christian Era to the Fourteenth Century and Islamic Homosexualities: Culture, History, and Literature.

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If you are a Christian, you may think that an Orthodox Jewish rabbi comes from such a different way of approaching our shared Scripture
that little would result from a lot of effort. Think again! This remarkable book is captivating from beginning to end and filled with
innumberable insights that grace virtually every page. Along the way, you may, as I discovered, come away with a whole new appreciation for Orthodox Judaism.
It s one thing to find a helpful book. It s quite another to find one helpful and delightful to read. Here are a couple of sentences worth mulling over: "Gayness is no more an automatic intentional rejection of procreation than is straightness a sworn promise of it." And, "Nature is a text that can say almost anything we want it to say while appearing to have said nothing but what is evident." Both of these statements
are found on the same page. This man can turn a phrase.
After quoting from a letter from a near-suicidal gay Orthodox Jew, (a feature familiar to many pastors and their gay parishioners) Rabbi Greenberg states his purpose for writing the book. "For the sake of this young man and many men and women very much like him, the first goal of this book is to demonstrate that, contrary to the
assumptions of many liberal and traditional Jews, an argument can be made in defense of gay relatioships from within the canon of traditional Jewish textual resources. What this man needs is not permission to have sex with men. That is hardly enough. What he needs is a way to envision a life of love, intimacy, and commitment with a man in the context of a religiously alive Orthodox community. The task of writing on this topic is to make a path that is responsible to these human realities and deeply
commit to God and Torah."
To reach his goal, Rabbi Greenberg divided his book into four sections. In Sacred Texts, he explores the biblical stories of Adam and Eve, Sodom and Gomorrah, and Leviticus that continue to shape Westen civilization s sexual ethics and gender identities. His discussion of the first not good of creation, Adams lonliness, and how God went about overcoming it, is worth the price of the book.
In Evidence, our rabbi surveys the positive ways in which the stories of Jonathan and David, Ruth and Naomi, and rabinnical stories
associated with gay themes have been treated up through the Middle Ages. He finds within the Jewish conversation what many Christian observers also found in this period, a lack of horror regarding same-sex love that we moderns are so possessed by.
The concluding chapter of this section involves the very unJewish notion that asking Why? is forbidden regarding Leviticus 18 and 20.
To ask is to open up the necessity for justifying one's answer, a slippery slope, indeed.
In Rationales, he returns to the fundamental prohibition posed in Leviticus, and asks the forbidden question, Why? What is
particularly problematic, immoral, or offensive about male-male intercourse in the first place? And why is female-female sex not a
concern? His critiques of arguments based on reproduction, social disruption, category confusion, and humiliation and violence, are
among the best, with original thinking in each case. This slope may be slippery, but it is ultimately freeing; and we are all the better for
sliding down it with him.
The concluding section, Conversations, offers a model for synagogues to welcome gay and lesbian people that is consistent with Orthodoxy and considerate of all concerned. It can almost be taken whole into Christian congregations seeking to find their way into inclusiveness, as well.
Conventional wisdom says that each of us has a book in us. In Rabbi Greenberg s case, I hope there is a library-full to come.

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Religion and Gays

Literary Pride--Amos Lassen



Greenberg, Rabbi Steven, Wrestling with God and Men: Homosexuality in the Jewish Tradition. Madison: University of Wisconsin Press, 2004.

Being a Jewish gay man, I wanted to know where I stood in terms of my religion--although to be quite honest, it didn't really matter. I had already formulated my dealings with religion and I had chosen the road that having been born a Jew, I would also die one and that was that. If any of you read my thoughts on the matter in my essay, A Piercing Thought then you know what I am talking about.



`Rabbi Steven Greenberg is an orthodox American rabbi who also happens to be gay. His book, Wrestling with God and Man: Homosexuality in the Jewish Tradition, is a result of his ten year struggle to reconcile self and religion. Greenberg's approach is Biblical in nature and he presents interpretations of the creation, of David and Jonathan, of the tale of Sodom and Gommorah and a new way of looking at the so-called taboos of Leviticus. His way of dealing with the issues is relationship centered and in doing this he draws on other texts to enhance the writings of the holy books. He reaches a conclusion similar to that of Rapoport--that a dialogue must be opened to be followed by debate and discussion, the same type of foundation upon which Judaic law is based.

This is not a book for Jews only. This is a book to be cherished by all who are interested in the topic of faith. What I loved was that it was written together with the author's own personal journey, Greenberg does not hold back--he says it as it is.

This is a valuable book for anyone who wants to attempt an understanding of the nature of God and man. I, personally, feel stronger in my faith for having read it. I believe you will also.